Thin styrene sheet.

[Mothman]

Hello,
does anyone know a source of VERY thin styrene sheet?  I have some of about 7 thou. which is supposed to be 5 thou, but I really need styrene like fag paper!  About 3thou.  Is it even made?  It's to do rib taping with stitching (stringing).  My idea of making it from ally tape, embossed from the sticky side worked in appearance, but not from a physical point of view in that the adhesive used is too weak in such small amounts and it moved all the time.
I need something I can emboss which will be more permanently gluable, but be as thin.

All suggestions of where to go for thin sheet welcome.

Cheers,
Martin

[Mark Braunlich]

Martin,
I do have some at .005" but not sure where it came from now; I've had it a long time.   Here's photo of 1:20 Greek D.H.9 free flight model with scale rib-stitching, the nicest I've ever seen on a model.

See link here for the builder and and the build:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1268736

Mark

[Mark Braunlich]

K & S Engineering here in the states supply most of the wire, tubing and other metals to model shops here.  (What's a model shop, daddy?)   They have copper and brass sheet in .002 and .003".   I would think it could be applied with some fairly aggressive spray adhesive and then perhaps a wipe over the top with slow setting epoxy.

Google them.

Mark

[Balsabasher]

Not sure if Slaters Plastikrd are still around ? but they did very thin Plastikard sheet,they were the manufacturers of allied product 'Mek Pak' adhesive,I have used 3M spray adhesive successfully then covering the tapes with fine tissue and a coat of dope.
Barry.

[Mothman]

Gents, 5 thou. looked too thick to me, when I tried it, but my 5 thou. seems a bit thick.
I have brass shim down to 3 thou, but it's very stiff and wouldn't mould round some of the curves like the ally tape.  And ally doesn't stick to anything with stuff like epoxy.  Just pops off the glue.  That's why I use ally to mould GRP surfaces!  I think it'll have to be styrene or ABS to really stick fast.
Mark, we also have K&S Metal centres over here and thank Heavens we do as I'd never find wire or their particularly nice malleable ally sheet from which i made an entire model boat in 1/6th scale once. Lovely stuff.

Barry, I like the paper method over as covering tape, but the American guy says it'll be too fragile for moulding from. Nonsense of course, but he won't be persuaded. I doubt he could damage them just pouring silicon rubber over them, once I've dope and painted the pattern! It's the tape with stitching first that is giving the problem, however if you say spray mount is good I'll get some.  I've only ever used it for a paste up in the graphics world.

Thanks all.

Martin

[Balsabasher]

Here is a good tip for you Martin to reproduce the ribbing for the moulder chap,I did not realise that it was going to be used as a pattern,lay up the wing tapes as per normal then get some Solartex from your local model shop,this material is intended for flying models but believe me it works equally as well on solids,lay the tex over the wing and seal the edges first neatly folding them over with the toe of a small iron ( I recommend you purchase a small iron for this made for model building ) next with an heat gun shrink up the tex and just watch it beautifully follow the contours of the ribbing,you can give the tex a shim of clear dope which will protect it prior to the moulding operation.
Barry.

[Mothman]

Barry,
would the Solartex not be a little overscale for a 1/32nd scale model?  I'm all for the tissue and dope method you mention and I reckon once that's painted, he wouldn't know any different. He'd just be happy with the result.  Now I have to find some tissue!!  That's when we miss the local model shop, isn't it?
Martin

[Balsabasher]

SAMS is your best place for tissue,and I see that Ben Buckle is advertising wet strengthened stuff on E-Bay as well,you can get heatshrink in thinner grades and it is quite thin,but tissue is what I would go for and once doped up he will not even know how you did it ?
Barry.

[lastvautour]

You might try these guys.

http://www.evergreenscalemodels.com/Sheets.htm#White Economy Packs

Lou

[Mothman]

I think the tissue sounds best for the covering tape and if I can get some 5 thou plastic, I'll use that for the stitching tape.  Best of both worlds.  Thanks chaps.

Martin

[Mothman]

Well, I stuck with the ally tape for the stitching and then separated the layers of a large nose blowing tissue and cut strips of it and doped them over the ally.
Then I sprayed it all to level it and the damned acrylic muck primer reacted and left it all with a slightly rough surface, but I think it'll survive. 
I shall now get some cellulose primer and thinners and use my spay gun. I am so heartily sick of acrylic. It is utterly unreliable rubbish which the nazis have forced upon us and I will NOT tolerate the imposition.  As long as cellulose paint can be had for the price of a lie on a form I'll have it!

Martin

[Balsabasher]

Martin I had no idea that you could still purchase cellulose products in the UK ? I was actually in the wholesaler of a car warehouse when a lorry pulled up one day and loaded the entire contents of the place of cellulose products,the ironic thing is that acrylics use a far more volatile additive to thin the paint and it is just as damaging to the ozone layer.
How do the vintage car boys cope with resprays ?
Barry.

[Mothman]

Barry, you go to a PROPER auto body refinishers and sign some stupid form stating that you're restoring a 1937 Austin Seven and they'll sell you cellulose, but the price has been hiked to dissuade you. Cellulose used to be dirt cheap. I could respray a whole car for under £100, now it's almost as expensive as two pack, which I despise even more than acrylic and it's poisonous too.
Cellulose dries quickly, smoothly and cleans quickly and without fuss. It smells nice and can be applied thin without fear of orange peel, something acrylic muck never can.  Best of all, cellulose always went on without reaction as long as it was the only paint used.  I've had acrylic react with itself until you could wipe the whole lot off with a rag a week after it went on. I've had it react with itself on the fourth coat, NOT the second as you might expect but the fourth!  Why four coats?  Because the lilly livered, water based filth has no substance and will not cover, coat after coat it will not cover.
It is rubbish and we put up with it.
I was left a load of Tamiya acrylics by a deceased friend.  I tried it and once again it wouldn't cover and reacted with going over enamel.  The entire box of it went straight in the bin same day!

I do not take kindly to the Nanny state and fight it every inch of the way.

Cheers,
Martin

[Balsabasher]

Acrylic is a product of the plastic world we live in,basically millions of polyvinyl beads are suspended in some kind of pigment and a binder,unlike cellulose it will not revive itself ie in that adding no amount of thinners will dissolve it again,notice also that if not completely dry and you try and go over it then it just breaks down and you are left with a big hole,even sanding it is not a good thing to do because the beads clog up and off it rolls,how on earth they  finish new cars on the production line with it is anyones guess ? one of the good things with cellulose was that you could ladle it on and it would flow into itself,not acrylic which refuses to flow,remember that wonderful finish 'Brushing Belco' which exploited celluloses ability to flow easily.
The only real good use of acrylic is in artwork when you need impasto effects that cure quickly,unlike old fashioned oils which took weeks to dry.
Tamiya had a few problems a year or so ago and went off the market,it was disvcovered that it had a dangerous additive,it took a long while before it came on the market again.
Why do they have to keep on changing things,and not for the better either ?
Barry.